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Post by Ymotion on Aug 24, 2009 15:55:59 GMT -5
Dear Bikram and Hot Yoga Community, I have started this board so that we, as whole can discuss with clear voices what will happen with the general community should all of you decide NOT to partake in Bikram Franchise. I completely understand the emotional stress that you are going through. Bikram is taking a stand. I actually really respect it. He is protecting himself and looking to provide himself a good income. Many of you are soon to be in a very REAL position that I and many others like me have been in for a very long time. You are going to be out of the official Bikram world. I know that MANY of you consider yourself's purist's and very loyal to Bikram and his method. I completely respect that. I am very loyal to my teacher also. I look forward to developing a new relationship with you all. Please check back often as I will be updating these boards regularly. All the best, Brian Monnier Certified Yoga teacher 2000 (Tony Sanchez) Studio owner since 2004 Owner: Yogic Motion www.yogicmotion.com |
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Post by longboard99 on Aug 26, 2009 17:27:46 GMT -5
hi
I am bikram certified, own two schools, and consider myself very loyal to the teachings of bikram.
anyone trained by Tony Sanchez is top notch in my book. He is brilliant
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Post by Ymotion on Aug 26, 2009 19:46:02 GMT -5
Welcome Longboard99!
Please spread the word. I hoping to create a new open dialogue (no pun intended) forum here.
I welcome all who wish to join.
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dd
New Member
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Post by dd on Aug 27, 2009 16:22:27 GMT -5
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Post by Ymotion on Aug 27, 2009 18:57:56 GMT -5
Thanks DD!
I only wish Jimmy was not on the other side of the county so I could go take his class!
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Post by yogatodd on Aug 27, 2009 21:54:58 GMT -5
My information is that existing studios operate under affiliation agreements. My prediciton is that Bikram will indeed begin to let the individual affiliation agreements expire. That is the stick. The carrot is that franchised studios will be much more profitable in the long term. The reality is that in a big market (suppose atlanta, GA), if none of the existing affiliated studios signed onto be a franchise, that some other player will open a franchised studio there. That studio will get all the support, but the other studios will be non-entities in that they will be sued if they violate trademarks or continue to teach bikram yoga and just call it something else.
Make no mistake about it, there will be plenty of players who want to get onboard. The money from the franchising i believe will indeed enable Bikram to police the situation and fire off lawsuits and cease and desist orders. Right now there are so many Bikram studios that are not up to standards. Here in Atlanta for example we have a Bikram studio that does not really conform to the heat standard, it is always too cold there. etc etc, that wont be allowed. Furthermore there is "Bikram" yoga being taught in all kinds of other Yoga studios essentially stealing from Bikram and Bastardizing Bikram Yoga. Even thousands of health clubs and gyms are bastardizing it.
For those reasons and others, I believe Bikram is playing hardball on this. I predict there wont be any concessions no matter how many existing studios revolt and refuse to sign. I predict that lots of affiliated studios will be allowed to renew their affiliations, but that as more come on board the franchise and more money starts rolling into headquarters, that fewer and eventually no affiliated studios will have their affiliation agreements renewed.
I predict that of course there will be some lawsuits by Bikram against others and Lawsuits by others against Bikram, but the Lawsuits that are precedent setting have already occured/Birkam prevailed. His method and sequence and Name and copywritability have been tested in the courts. I do not think Bikram is going to compromise, and I dont see how the studios that dont sign are going to keep teaching Bikram Yoga legally (they can't). Some may just decide to do it anyway and let the chips fall where they may.
And it may take some time for the chips to start falling . But they will fall. There is lots of leverage from Bikram's side. All the Bikram teachers in good standing jeapordize that if they teach in a non-affiliated studio or non-franchised studio. They will no longer be authorized therefore to teach in a franchised Bikram Studio or Own a franchised Bikram studio. I wish everyone would realize how much money is at stake here, and realize they are either going to be with bikram on this one or become the enemy. I read that 7% of yoga classes taken in usa are authorized Bikram classes. Thats a lot of clams! On top of that there are knock off studios and health clubs teaching it so the percentage is really much higher.
I predict Bikram is willing to cut studios loose who dont sign. Then you will eventually be sued and out of business or you have to teach another style of yoga. Good luck with that! It might not go so well. I also think that those who sign and sign early will be supported very well. After all Bikram is nothing else if not a good promoter! He will certainly promote the studios and support the franchisees!
The interesting part will of course be the transition period. It will be tumultuous and exciting, because lots of people are against change. I think the biggest mistake right now is thinking that by getting lots of owners to boycott the changes that it will affect the process: it wont. Another mistake is for studio owners to think that they can just keep on teaching Bikram, or change it a bit and try to keep teaching some flavor of Bikram, and have no consequences from that. Rest assured Bikram is anticipating a fight. As far as coming up with your own yoga, people do it all the time. A truly inspired person can do it. but Its the exception, certainly not the rule.
Another prediction is that the franchised studios will in a few years be **WILDLY*** successful, in terms of numbers of new students, way beyond what studios are seeing at this time. If that means a lot of studios are going to be pushed to the side in the face of this positive change , so be it!
Todd Gibson
yogatodd@hotmail.com
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Post by yogatodd on Aug 27, 2009 21:56:44 GMT -5
>hotlikebikramyoga-
>Do you really think that all the students currently practicing at affiliated studios will just ditch their home studio in favor of a f>ranchised studio? Of course, that is assuming there will even BE a franchised studio in the area. New franchisees must be i>ndependently wealthy in order to open. Do you also predict that there are many people who can afford to do that? With many >studios not signing, where do you expect all these wildly successful franchised studios to open?
I dont think the students currently practicing at affiliated studios will suddenly jump to a different studio just because it is franchised, but i do know that if that affiliated studio's affiliation agreement is allowed to expire and it is not renewed by Bikram, then they will be very vulnerable to "stick" actions like lawsuits and cease and desist orders and things. They have the chioce to either change the class sessions enough to avoid future negative consequences (which the clientelle-existing clientelle would reject - and this clientelle might then go to a hypothetical franchised studio. The real question here is whether or not Bikram's copywright stuff has teeth and can be enforced. I think the only obstacle to that at this time is money. I think enough people will join the franchise to give Bikram the money to enforce it , and that he is the kind of entity to pursue it with a rabid vengeance!
As far as being independently wealthy in order to open a studio under the franchise, the only difference I see is the initial 10k fee and also the minimum standard studio requirements are more expensive.. Since I have investigated opening a studio (under affiliation) I know that start up costs are very high, perhaps just almost as high as the FDD would make those costs.
I think a big mistake here is to think that through some kind of negotiation Bikram will somehow change his mind on the FDD. I really doubt it is open to negotiation. Existing students who are already in the habit of going to Bikram classes (real Bikram Classes) will definately go to a franchised studio over and above going to knock off Bikram Studios like some kind of Hot Yoga studios. People who are into Bikram proper (like me) dont like things like Atlanta Hot Yoga's so called Bikram Classes. They are not the same effect at all.
So again, my view is that this whole debacle can be summed up practically to the question ****** "how are policing efforts likely to go?"******* HOW ARE POLICING EFFORTS LIKELY TO GO.? Thats the question to analyze. If reasonable minds in the legal community ponder it the answer can be determined based on existing case law. My view is that confidence in legal strategies for forcing rogue Bikram studios, hot Yoga studios, gymnasiums and health clubs, and others has driven this FDD. Basically headquarters believes the court cases they have won gives put them in a good position to win some big key lawsuits in the very near future. In other words they will sue some big studio names soon, maybe some health club chains, and certainly they plan to sue some big studios who begin to operate as normal but without a current valid affiliation agreement. Those they believe they will win, and then the rest of the potential legal opponents, potential lawssuits will either see the writing on the wall or they will lose as well.
I could be wrong in my prediction on Headquarters being successfell at enforcement and policing stratedies. Headquarters could be wrong too. My view is that nothing in the FDD is arbitrary and its been better thought out than many irate Studio owners seem to think. Many seem to think all that needs to be done is everybody just not sign. My view is that contingency has already been anticipated, and anyway is unrealistic.
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Post by yogatodd on Aug 27, 2009 21:58:06 GMT -5
Today at 1:03pm, todd gibson wrote:
My information is....
My prediciton is....
Make no mistake about it....
For those reasons and others, I believe Bikram....
I predict....
I predict....
I predict that....
I predict Bikram is....
I also think that....
Another prediction is
Whew! Your crystal ball is on fire Todd! it's glowing angry red back there behind all the smoke and mirrors.
And by the way, you are obviously not as well informed as you pretend or are being paid to pretend to be "the Lawsuits that are precedent setting have already occured/Birkam prevailed". He did not prevail. That was the spin put on it. The truth is that he settled the lawsuits, he did not win. Sadly, you're trying to scare people with misinformation, conjecture, and opinion. Then again, that's just par for the course isn't it? Nothing's changed.
Re: "if none of the existing affiliated studios signed on to be a franchise, then some other player will open a franchised studio there. That studio will get all the support". What a laugh! You obviously are not a studio owner, or anyone else who ever needed something from HQ. Nothing's changed, certainly not that. Check out another post about the same time as yours where somebody called HQ and the person answering the phone didn't even know who Allison was! Typical.
Even the business training that's mentioned in the FDD that's supposed to be given by Bikram, Raj, Emmy, Craig, Jason, and Diane Ducharme? Oh great. More of the same useless blather. HQ's loses thousands of dollars a year, and that's with teachers teaching for free! Emmy and Craig have never run a school, Jason sold his school. And Diane? Good luck to her, she's got one heck of a job ahead of her.
Put your crystal ball away Todd and go cash your paycheck. Fearmongering is an ugly business.
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Post by yogatodd on Aug 27, 2009 21:58:49 GMT -5
sorry this got posted in 2 threads !
'im truly sorry if I have offended or caused fear! not my intention. i said Bikram prevailed. the lawsuits were settled, that means damages were paid and/or concessions were made. If the defendants lawyers thought they would win they would not have settled. so i stand by my statement that Bikram prevailed in the lawsuits. he didn't lose any to my knowledge.
If they settled the lawsuit and paid Bikram and made concession I do admit thats not the same as a courts judge declaring Bikrams side won! In that regard the case law is yet to be determined, and the lawsuits that will be filed will determine the future case law in this regard. I'm not a lawyer, so I dont have perfect knowledge of legal protocols but i can use logic and reasoning. However, I do know that the outcome of lawsuits is equal to a legal precedent that other courts generally follow.
all of our comments about what may happen in the future are conjecture. some conjecture, however, can be shown to be more logically sound and incorporate more and better information. none of us has a crystal ball, but we can use logic. logic, not a crystal ball, says that headquarters must believe they will prevail legally or the FDD doesn't make sense. What I mean when I wrote ""if none of the existing affiliated studios signed on to be a franchise, then some other player will open a franchised studio there. That studio will get all the support" I meant they get the support of being part of a franchise, that support is advertising, merchandising, gruop purchasing power and such. They get the support compared to the former affiliate studio who will be out in the cold in terms of legally being able to Use the Bikram Name or even teaching an altered or exact Bikram Session.
So far, I have not heard any meaningful analysis or comments on WHETHERR HEADQUARTERS BELIEF THAT THEY WILL BE SUCCESSFUL WITH LEGAL POLICING IS VALID OR NOT. In other words, what is the likely outcome of future lawsuits and policing actions? Are they at headquarters just gambling that it will all work out? That does not fit what we know about Bikram.
There are likely to be lots of lawsuits, even a lawsuit by a bloc of studio owners and bikram teaching certificate holders isn't hard to envision. If legal actions are not likely to go Bikrams way, then revolt by all the studio owners would influence him to alter conditions. If not, of course there is no reason for him to change his mind. There is a lot of money at stake. Suppose 10% sign on, thats more than enough to continue the momentum, and still brings more money than he is getting right now. 20 or 30 successful studios paying 5% and more to Bikram will certainly fund lawyers and lawsuits initially to strategic key (lucrative) studios and markets, and far exceed the teacher training revenues very soon.
If he sues somebody and loses over this sequence copywrite thing or trademarks use, the whole thing will be a flop. If he sues a few key lucrative big name rogue studios or some who let the affiliation agreement lapse and continues as business as usual, if he sues them and wins, well thats case law right there, and that is what headquarters is "banking" on. Crystal ball not needed!
Personally I see the side of the existing owners that are irate about the whole thing. Financial protection and protection of the integrity and purity of the Bikram Yoga Style are one and the same. The money is just a metaphor for control. Am I saying Bikram doesn't care about the money? Of course not, but it is still beside the point! The point is not what "should" be but what "is" happening". What is happening is that Bikram is tightening down and is ready for a fight and there is absolutely no indication that he will relent or change his mind of alter the FDD whatsoever.
Will Bikram win lawsuits alleging copywrite infringement or wont he? Thats the question. All the available evidence indicates he can prevent the use of his name, and yoga method by unauthorized studios and "entities" otherwise this never would have been launched. Can he prevail in court or not?
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Post by Yoga Student on May 7, 2010 9:14:42 GMT -5
I have just been informed by our Bikram studio owner that teachers are not to socialize with students, even off the job. Supposedly this is a Bikram directive. Has anyone ever heard of such a rule of conduct at Bikram studios?
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